divemaster5734
Full Access Member
lol.. that's some hot coffee, a few degrees from water steam..
Best location for E4OD temp sensor?
- Thread starter MtnHaul
- Start date
Cant Write
Full Access Member
Ok I bit and went down the rabbit hole. Also known as the “giggle” machine.
CYA: The summarization of the regurgitated information here within is from a memory bank within my brain that was regularly subjected to large amounts of Budweiser and Whiskey in my youth due to a disagreement between my body and brain......
Conventional Fluid:
220F: Varnish Starts to form on frictions and hard parts which allow the clutches to slip more creating more heat. Vicious Cycle
240F: Seals Harden, Additives Cook
260F: Clutches begin to slip as fluid is breaking down rapidly
315F: Seals Clutches Burn out and Carbon is formed. The fluid is useless and will cook a trans in short order.
Synthetic Fluid can handle higher temps but couldn’t find stuff like the above. Basically found things saying 220F is fine and 250F is getting close to the danger zone.
Synthetic fluid is able to keep the viscosity up at higher temps so the pump can create proper pressure to avoid slippage.
There’s also flash temp vs prolonged temp.
OEM’s seem to mostly measure fluid temp in the pan or body of the trans. (Aisin) has an option to watch converter temps in the RAMs I guess. Seems OEM’s put the vehicle in limp mode after so many seconds of fluid temps ranging around 270F.
My experience: I have BOILED a 4l80e on FSR’s running 4-hi 2nd gear vs 4-lo 3rd gear. The trans was literally puking fluid from everywhere underneath (vent....?) (only rad cooler at the time). I have also been been put on the side of the road at 3am on a long climb on I-40 letting the computer control my vehicle (2007 Yukon Denali 6.2/6l80) when the XMAS tree lit up due to trans fluid temps. TH-400 has never failed me with only rad cooling, same with TH-350. I grew up GM.
I have been convinced that doing what @Cubey does is best practice to measure both.
Run synthetic and lube guard if Post ‘86 Ford trans (website said that)
I would run a TC output sensor and put 250F as my prepare and 270F as my take action temp. And run a pan temp and expect 100F over ambient or cooler. Pop the hood and look/smell fluid once in awhile.
Since I’m short on time, I plan to do neither on my 4l80 (added external cooler) or E4OD and just keep smelling/looking at the fluid and change every 30-50k.
You guys hauling heavy or towing often, I also went down the rabbit hole of how hot the rear axle gets.....yikes!!
Please correct anything I misstated!!
CYA: The summarization of the regurgitated information here within is from a memory bank within my brain that was regularly subjected to large amounts of Budweiser and Whiskey in my youth due to a disagreement between my body and brain......
Conventional Fluid:
220F: Varnish Starts to form on frictions and hard parts which allow the clutches to slip more creating more heat. Vicious Cycle
240F: Seals Harden, Additives Cook
260F: Clutches begin to slip as fluid is breaking down rapidly
315F: Seals Clutches Burn out and Carbon is formed. The fluid is useless and will cook a trans in short order.
Synthetic Fluid can handle higher temps but couldn’t find stuff like the above. Basically found things saying 220F is fine and 250F is getting close to the danger zone.
Synthetic fluid is able to keep the viscosity up at higher temps so the pump can create proper pressure to avoid slippage.
There’s also flash temp vs prolonged temp.
OEM’s seem to mostly measure fluid temp in the pan or body of the trans. (Aisin) has an option to watch converter temps in the RAMs I guess. Seems OEM’s put the vehicle in limp mode after so many seconds of fluid temps ranging around 270F.
My experience: I have BOILED a 4l80e on FSR’s running 4-hi 2nd gear vs 4-lo 3rd gear. The trans was literally puking fluid from everywhere underneath (vent....?) (only rad cooler at the time). I have also been been put on the side of the road at 3am on a long climb on I-40 letting the computer control my vehicle (2007 Yukon Denali 6.2/6l80) when the XMAS tree lit up due to trans fluid temps. TH-400 has never failed me with only rad cooling, same with TH-350. I grew up GM.
I have been convinced that doing what @Cubey does is best practice to measure both.
Run synthetic and lube guard if Post ‘86 Ford trans (website said that)
I would run a TC output sensor and put 250F as my prepare and 270F as my take action temp. And run a pan temp and expect 100F over ambient or cooler. Pop the hood and look/smell fluid once in awhile.
Since I’m short on time, I plan to do neither on my 4l80 (added external cooler) or E4OD and just keep smelling/looking at the fluid and change every 30-50k.
You guys hauling heavy or towing often, I also went down the rabbit hole of how hot the rear axle gets.....yikes!!
Please correct anything I misstated!!
Well in the case of the RV, the original intent was to read the TC output, and I was given bad advice by the overpriced transmission shop in regards to cooling. The owner said bypass the rad cooler and run only the aux cooler. TC output was in the red zone, like 300+. I had gone north from Portland to Puyallup to fetch my stuff from storage with the mostly empty cargo trailer but then it slipped out of park etc).
So after 3 nights in a motel because it took me 3 days to empty storage and donate at least half of it, I went back to @Nero 's house because I now had to replace the broken grey water tank and related parts. I plumbed back the rad cooler on my way back and it helped the TC output temperature.
At that point, I decided to dump the barely used ATF in case it got too hot and put a deep aluminum pan with a temperature port and put fresh ATF again. I decided to leave the TC output one because why not, it was already teed in the steel line with a compression fitting.
So then, I had two gauges.
I pulled the TC output gauge from the RV before selling it, putting a straight union on in it's place, leaving the nuts and compression rings, so the tee was just removed and a union put on. Same threads on the union and nuts. Worked fine, no leaks.
And I put that reading from the test port of the van's e4od.
That's why I was babying the van so much a month ago, it kept approaching 220, presumably due to the AC condenser being a poor cooler.
The fluid does seem dark, it probably needs to be replaced. Who in how hot it was getting before I had a gauge telling me how hot it was getting!
I hate pan dropping, might just drain and replace for now, since I think factory E4OD pans have a drain?
The only transmission shop I liked here closed down several years ago, pre-covid. I'm guessing that the owner just retired or died and nobody in the family wanted to run it. I don't trust the other shops around here.
4R100 pans do, and they fit on an E4OD. But to my knowledge the factory pans didn’t have a drain.
divemaster5734
Full Access Member
I have a dead E4OD waiting for a scrap run sitting in the bone pile from the ZF swap.
Planned on heading over there today, will check the pan, if it has a drain you can have it.
Will get word back to you by end of today if that works.
I thought I saw a drain on this, but maybe the pan was swapped at some point, or I was mistaken. I'm currently too sick to go lay on the ground to look around for it.
XOLATEM
Full Access Member
A diesel E4OD...sounds worthy of a rebuild and putting back into circulation...
I know that somebody can use it and be thankful...
I had asked My Girl if She would consider a diesel Ford truck because I am looking for a home for a perfectly good 6.9 that I am going to take out of my truck when I change it over to a 7.3T...
...and...she said 'Sure'...as long as it was an automatic....
AAHHHAAUUGGGH.....NNNOOOOOOO......
I am cringeing...remembering all of the good transmission cores that have been scrapped over the years...making parts and cases (unique cases...) more expensive because they are 'harder to get'...
Could you at least please offer it up on Marketplace before it is gone...forever...?
They are a bolt on swap. Some aftermarket pans have the drain too.
divemaster5734
Full Access Member
Never thought about that, probably because OD was fried long before I got it, I'm the 3rd owner, the guy I got it from made sure to inform me he couldn't drive past 55mph due to rpm's.
First thing I did was 4" lift and 35's, which got me to 70 for short bursts.
Did just finish a C6 rebuild, maybe a E4OD wouldn't be a bad winter project.
IDIBRONCO
IDIBRONCO
I don't know where the temp was taken at, but I worked for a guy who had a '08 Duramax. It would go into limp mode when the trans temp got to *210. I was riving it when we went to Colorado in 2015. Coming in to Colorado Springs from the east, I had to take it out of tow/haul in order to keep the temps down below *205. The limp mode cut off wasn't 100% chiseled in stone. Going over Cottonwood Pass west of Buena Vista, most of the east side is speed limit 30 or maybe 35. The trans temp was up to *235, but I wasn't fiving it much throttle. Apparently the throttle position made a difference. In the end, after tow years of fighting the problem, he put a new radiator in the truck and that solved the problem.
That's why I feel like it's a goof idea to run synthetic in the rear end when pulling/hauling heavy a lot.
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